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Council Blindsided by McGinn's Seawall Proposal

[Editor's Note: This was originally posted at 4pm.]


-6

Mayor Mike McGinn addresses city council members and staff, including Jean Godden, left.

City council members and staff said they were taken aback by Mayor Mike McGinn’s proposal this morning to put a $241 million bond measure on the ballot in May to pay for replacement of the downtown waterfront seawall.

Most council members only found out about the proposal by phone or voice mail last night or this morning (when all nine council members were attending their annual retreat at the Bell Harbor Conference Center). One—transportation committee chair Tom Rasmussen, whom one might assume McGinn would want to include in an announcement separating viaduct replacement from the seawall—found out about the proposal from a reporter late this morning.

At his press conference, McGinn said he was “encouraged” by his conversations with the council—a statement that made more than one council member chuckle. “He didn’t talk to me,” several told me this afternoon.

McGinn did reportedly ask council president Richard Conlin last night to participate in this morning’s press conference announcing the bond proposal, but Conlin was unable to do so because of the day-long retreat.

In a question-and-answer setting at the council retreat this afternoon, council members grilled McGinn on the process by which he arrived at today’s announcement.

“I’m getting a number of calls from the press asking what I think of the seawall proposal, and I haven’t really had any information on it,” Rasmussen said. “Is this an example of how you plan to make decisions in the future?”

McGinn responded: “I have never heard anyone say that we do not need to replace the seawall… The council, of course, can choose to modify or work it or deal with it as they see fit.”

Also in response to Rasmussen’s question, McGinn called the seawall a “simple [project], physically,” prompting council member Sally Clark to ask why he believed that. “You just described the seawall as relatively simple, which is interesting, because when I think of the Port, and the tribes, and the desire to do a really innovative seawall the recognizes all the people in that area…  it seems like it’s a pretty complicated” project.

Council members also expressed concern that McGinn was separating seawall replacement from planning for the waterfront (McGinn spokesman Mark Matassa told me he considered them “separate projects”), when the two have always been seen as linked. (Waterfront planning includes parks, salmon recovery, and work with local tribes, among other things that don’t appear to be explicitly included in McGinn’s proposal. “Our expectation was that we were going to look at this in the context of the whole waterfront planning effort,” Rasmussen said. “It seems like he’s rejected that.”

Rasmussen also noted that the council has been considering a number of other financing sources—including a local improvement district, a transportation benefits district, and a parking tax—to pay for seawall replacement. A bond measure would supplant any of those options.

The council will have to vote by March on whether to put the seawall measure on the May ballot, where it will need 60 percent of the vote to win. Because they haven’t seen the details of the proposal, several council members said, they couldn’t say whether they would vote for or against the measure. “We’re going to have to put together a proposal really fast,” Rasmussen said.

And several, including Nick Licata, noted that the seawall bond measure would compete with a number of other potential levies this year, including the Seattle education levy (Feb. 9), the Families and Education Levy (2011), a potential levy for light-rail expansion (undetermined, but the likeliest date appears to be November 2010), and a potential levy for parks operations.

Asked how he planned to prioritize all the various potential levies, McGinn responded, “The only two things that are on the horizon right now are the Families and Education Levy next year and a commitment to bring a light rail expansion levy to the ballot in two years. I’m not aware that they are any other expiring levies, and I haven’t put any measures on the table.”

McGinn also suggested that the recently repealed “head tax” (a $25 tax on employees who drive to work alone) might be a source of funding for transit in the future, prompting council member Tim Burgess to shout, “Yeah, right!” As the room erupted in laughter, council member Jean Godden added more quietly: “Good luck.”


  • Mr. X

    This is getting good!

  • Mr. X

    This is getting good!

  • McGrinn

    Mayor 0 Council 1

    A big fail to McGinn. I supported McGinn in the election, but everyone is scared of how he’ll be able to work with Council. So far, not so good.

    Mike, get it together buddy. Otherwise you’ll be a one term Mayor.

  • McGrinn

    Mayor 0 Council 1

    A big fail to McGinn. I supported McGinn in the election, but everyone is scared of how he’ll be able to work with Council. So far, not so good.

    Mike, get it together buddy. Otherwise you’ll be a one term Mayor.

  • CouncilofNo

    McGinn: “Let’s do something, we need to fix this!”
    Council: “No.”
    McGinn: “I have ideas, let’s fix these problems!”
    Council: “No.”

    *election approaches*

    McGinn: “Here’s what the Council said when I attempted to move forward on vital projects…”

  • CouncilofNo

    McGinn: “Let’s do something, we need to fix this!”
    Council: “No.”
    McGinn: “I have ideas, let’s fix these problems!”
    Council: “No.”

    *election approaches*

    McGinn: “Here’s what the Council said when I attempted to move forward on vital projects…”

  • McGrinn

    @3 – the issue so far (and keep in mind we’re WAY early) isn’t a council of no, it’s a Mayor who doesn’t work at all with the council. I assume he’ll have a huge learning curve and so hopefully this is just and early miscue we won’t see too much of in the future, but it’s definitely an early fuck up.

  • McGrinn

    @3 – the issue so far (and keep in mind we’re WAY early) isn’t a council of no, it’s a Mayor who doesn’t work at all with the council. I assume he’ll have a huge learning curve and so hopefully this is just and early miscue we won’t see too much of in the future, but it’s definitely an early fuck up.

  • Nickels’ 3rd Term

    True to his word, McGinn is transparent. We can see right through him.

  • Nickels’ 3rd Term

    True to his word, McGinn is transparent. We can see right through him.

  • TizzyMarie

    So, let me try to keep up. Mayor McGinn has been in office for 10 days. So far he’s stamped the go ahead on the tunnel, ignored a teen shooting that involved Seattle kids, reconfigured the police chief search committee (which he gave Mallahan hell for during the election), and blindsided City Council with a levy proposal for the seawall, claiming that it’s “not that complicated”. Meanwhile, anyone who has been thinking about our waterfront knows that this seawall isn’t simply replacing timbers and concrete, but has the potential to transform our connection with the water. Councilmember Clark has it exactly right– this is far from “simple”. Schadenfreude would be a lot more fun if my city wasn’t getting fucked in the process. All hail [shadow] Mayor Burgess!

  • Edog

    @3 Act II

    Council: We were out of town when you announced this, in an effort to get one over on us, even when you needed our support.

    McGinn: I’m known for cojones, not my cajoles!

  • TizzyMarie

    So, let me try to keep up. Mayor McGinn has been in office for 10 days. So far he’s stamped the go ahead on the tunnel, ignored a teen shooting that involved Seattle kids, reconfigured the police chief search committee (which he gave Mallahan hell for during the election), and blindsided City Council with a levy proposal for the seawall, claiming that it’s “not that complicated”. Meanwhile, anyone who has been thinking about our waterfront knows that this seawall isn’t simply replacing timbers and concrete, but has the potential to transform our connection with the water. Councilmember Clark has it exactly right– this is far from “simple”. Schadenfreude would be a lot more fun if my city wasn’t getting fucked in the process. All hail [shadow] Mayor Burgess!

  • Edog

    @3 Act II

    Council: We were out of town when you announced this, in an effort to get one over on us, even when you needed our support.

    McGinn: I’m known for cojones, not my cajoles!

  • Charlie Peterson

    Welcome to amature hour on the 7th Floor.

    Wow, reminds me of the early days of Paul Schell and the council. Schell thought the power of a good idea was all he needed to win approval. Remember selling Key Tower?

    Seems to me that the levy is a bad idea. If it does fail, we will still need to replace the seawall. McGinn would have to come up with another financing measure — one that wouldn’t go to the voters — which would be a replay of Safeco Field all over again.

  • Charlie Peterson

    Welcome to amature hour on the 7th Floor.

    Wow, reminds me of the early days of Paul Schell and the council. Schell thought the power of a good idea was all he needed to win approval. Remember selling Key Tower?

    Seems to me that the levy is a bad idea. If it does fail, we will still need to replace the seawall. McGinn would have to come up with another financing measure — one that wouldn’t go to the voters — which would be a replay of Safeco Field all over again.

  • tpn

    Did McGinn really think of this?

    This is merely putting the tunnel on the ballot by other means. If people will say “no new taxes” for a seawall replacement, he can claim “victory” as a vital component of viaduct replacement goes on the skids, while never having to take blame for opposing it. He’s attempting institute the “surface” option via subterfuge, hoping that a knee-jerk reaction by the voters will bolster that effort, IMO.

    To bad for him it was executed so poorly.

  • tpn

    Did McGinn really think of this?

    This is merely putting the tunnel on the ballot by other means. If people will say “no new taxes” for a seawall replacement, he can claim “victory” as a vital component of viaduct replacement goes on the skids, while never having to take blame for opposing it. He’s attempting institute the “surface” option via subterfuge, hoping that a knee-jerk reaction by the voters will bolster that effort, IMO.

    To bad for him it was executed so poorly.

  • Anonymous

    I don’t get it. Sally Clark has never seen an upzone or a hight restriction variance request that wasn’t a simple slam dunk. So why do habitat restoration and civil works projects always seem “pretty complicated” to her?

    Go Mike go!!!

  • Mud Baby

    I don’t get it. Sally Clark has never seen an upzone or a hight restriction variance request that wasn’t a simple slam dunk. So why do habitat restoration and civil works projects always seem “pretty complicated” to her?

    Go Mike go!!!

  • Nickels’ 3rd Term

    Schadenfreude, indeed.

    Dude doesn’t even know how much he doesn’t know. Good thing the city pretty much runs itself. Hope he gets a clue soon.

  • Nickels’ 3rd Term

    Schadenfreude, indeed.

    Dude doesn’t even know how much he doesn’t know. Good thing the city pretty much runs itself. Hope he gets a clue soon.

  • The Riddler

    I don’t mean to be a downer, but it seems so left field that it’s either (a) some kind of brilliant political maneuver or (b) unrelated to anything of necessity in the year 2010, location: Puget Sound.

    I’m willing to hear arguments for (a) but it’s screaming (b).

  • The Riddler

    I don’t mean to be a downer, but it seems so left field that it’s either (a) some kind of brilliant political maneuver or (b) unrelated to anything of necessity in the year 2010, location: Puget Sound.

    I’m willing to hear arguments for (a) but it’s screaming (b).

  • TJ

    @7

    Bell Harbor Conference Center (where the Council had their annual retreat) is on the Seattle waterfront. It’s hardly “out of town.”

  • TJ

    @7

    Bell Harbor Conference Center (where the Council had their annual retreat) is on the Seattle waterfront. It’s hardly “out of town.”

  • RonK, Seattle

    The McGinn debacle is off to a lightning-fast start!

    (I still blame Nickels.)

  • RonK, Seattle

    The McGinn debacle is off to a lightning-fast start!

    (I still blame Nickels.)

  • Mikos

    Nickels ran over the city council successfully. Why wouldn’t McGinn use the same strategy? Until they show they can do something about McGinn would be foolish to treat the with dererance. Nickels persoanl unpopularity, not his treatment of the council, are what ran him out of office. McGinn has a strategy here and I would not underestimate him.

  • Mikos

    Nickels ran over the city council successfully. Why wouldn’t McGinn use the same strategy? Until they show they can do something about McGinn would be foolish to treat the with dererance. Nickels persoanl unpopularity, not his treatment of the council, are what ran him out of office. McGinn has a strategy here and I would not underestimate him.

  • Edog

    @13 “Out of town” should have been “Out of Office” yeah yeah there is a difference, but not much with the real effect that they were “taken aback”

  • Edog

    @13 “Out of town” should have been “Out of Office” yeah yeah there is a difference, but not much with the real effect that they were “taken aback”

  • Soapboxin’

    @15. I’m glad someone is attempting to give some kind of spin or explanation. Preaching to the choir gets boring.

    I’ll tell you know what, though. I’ll be very happy when I can look in the mirror and say, “Soap, you have underestimated Mike McGinn.” That will truly be a good day for Seattle. Unfortunately, he’s doing a great job of living down to my expectations so far. And I sense that I’m not alone.

    If he didn’t ramble on and arrogantly patronize us so much, maybe we wouldn’t feel that way. As Andre Agassi said, “Image is everything.”

  • Soapboxin’

    @15. I’m glad someone is attempting to give some kind of spin or explanation. Preaching to the choir gets boring.

    I’ll tell you know what, though. I’ll be very happy when I can look in the mirror and say, “Soap, you have underestimated Mike McGinn.” That will truly be a good day for Seattle. Unfortunately, he’s doing a great job of living down to my expectations so far. And I sense that I’m not alone.

    If he didn’t ramble on and arrogantly patronize us so much, maybe we wouldn’t feel that way. As Andre Agassi said, “Image is everything.”

  • Seattle Resident

    It used to be the Council throwing rocks at the Mayor. I see the tables turning; a “little-guy” Mayor up against the Big Bad Council. (Little being figurative, of course.)

    Perhaps Mayor McGinn is positioning himself as Obama against what he will paint as an intransigent Council?

  • Seattle Resident

    It used to be the Council throwing rocks at the Mayor. I see the tables turning; a “little-guy” Mayor up against the Big Bad Council. (Little being figurative, of course.)

    Perhaps Mayor McGinn is positioning himself as Obama against what he will paint as an intransigent Council?

  • West Seattle Waiter

    Wow! this is incredible he doesn’t even tell anyone on the council that he is putting up a Quarter of A BILLION DOLLAR bond proposal!!!! Or anyone else. WTF

    Only two answers: he is really using it to kill the tunnel in some sort of voter approved model — Seattle passive aggressive style OR he is so over his head and immature that he should have recall petitions taken against him. Either way the people of Seattle are screwed.

  • West Seattle Waiter

    Wow! this is incredible he doesn’t even tell anyone on the council that he is putting up a Quarter of A BILLION DOLLAR bond proposal!!!! Or anyone else. WTF

    Only two answers: he is really using it to kill the tunnel in some sort of voter approved model — Seattle passive aggressive style OR he is so over his head and immature that he should have recall petitions taken against him. Either way the people of Seattle are screwed.

  • pete

    Team McGinn looks pretty stupid on this one. However, perhaps they think putting the seawall on the ballot is a way to undo the DBT agreement council adopted just before the fall election since it committed the city to replacement of the seawall. Funding a project that voters have rejected at the polls would not be easy for the council. No skin off McGinn’s chin if voters did the unlikely and approved with > 60%.

    Is this leadership?

  • pete

    Team McGinn looks pretty stupid on this one. However, perhaps they think putting the seawall on the ballot is a way to undo the DBT agreement council adopted just before the fall election since it committed the city to replacement of the seawall. Funding a project that voters have rejected at the polls would not be easy for the council. No skin off McGinn’s chin if voters did the unlikely and approved with > 60%.

    Is this leadership?

  • gloomy gus

    Absolutely hilarious that he’d so unhesitatingly show the Council his behind.

  • gloomy gus

    Absolutely hilarious that he’d so unhesitatingly show the Council his behind.

  • WOW !

    The next four years are going to be great. Only problem for Mike on this one is that he needs 5 votes from the Council to get this measure on the ballot. Word to Publicola – time to form a corporation around your blog and sell some stock. Mike will ensure that you all become very wealthy.

  • WOW !

    The next four years are going to be great. Only problem for Mike on this one is that he needs 5 votes from the Council to get this measure on the ballot. Word to Publicola – time to form a corporation around your blog and sell some stock. Mike will ensure that you all become very wealthy.

  • West Seattle Waiter

    Maybe they could of used the dozens of IPhones that they bought off the taxpayers dime and called the council or anyone before they announced this deal.

  • West Seattle Waiter

    Maybe they could of used the dozens of IPhones that they bought off the taxpayers dime and called the council or anyone before they announced this deal.

  • Zander

    I still don’t get that candidate McGinn did not make this a bigger issue during the campaign as it is his first major proposal. My guess is that he only now is starting to get it and that is a major red flag. I also don’t think the media should give him a free ride on project management and cost over runs. His commercials repeated ad naueseum that big projects have big over runs and that Seattle could not afford them. He’s handing us a bill before he has done much of anything besides rearrange the furniture.

  • Zander

    I still don’t get that candidate McGinn did not make this a bigger issue during the campaign as it is his first major proposal. My guess is that he only now is starting to get it and that is a major red flag. I also don’t think the media should give him a free ride on project management and cost over runs. His commercials repeated ad naueseum that big projects have big over runs and that Seattle could not afford them. He’s handing us a bill before he has done much of anything besides rearrange the furniture.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    4. McGinn will make the mistake of worrying way to much about Councilmember Tim Burgess potential run against him in 2013, while Council President Richard Conlin does the real work of moving the councils’ agenda past McGinn.

    The race to consume the city’s bonding capacity began 6 months ago.

    5. Councilmember Nick Licata does not want to relive the monorail. This will be an obstical for Mike McGinn attempt to force an early public vote on his West Side light rail.
    For fun, substitute “AWV Tunnel” for “Sound Transit”, and “West Side Light Rail” for “Monorail” here: Urban Politics #89.

    http://manywordsforrain.blogspot.com/2009/12/predictions-for-2010.html

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    4. McGinn will make the mistake of worrying way to much about Councilmember Tim Burgess potential run against him in 2013, while Council President Richard Conlin does the real work of moving the councils’ agenda past McGinn.

    The race to consume the city’s bonding capacity began 6 months ago.

    5. Councilmember Nick Licata does not want to relive the monorail. This will be an obstical for Mike McGinn attempt to force an early public vote on his West Side light rail.
    For fun, substitute “AWV Tunnel” for “Sound Transit”, and “West Side Light Rail” for “Monorail” here: Urban Politics #89.

    http://manywordsforrain.blogspot.com/2009/12/predictions-for-2010.html

  • misha

    Wow. Why the McGinn hate? I strongly approve of putting these measures on the ballot so we actually move forward – Seattle is not going to reject light rail and won’t reject the seawall unless the council sabotages the measure.

    I’ll add some Licata hate – here’s a man who has proven to be the most conservative member of the council for years and is not shy about it, yet the local media keeps giving him a free pass. He’s opposed to replacing the seawall because the levy would compete in a year with at least one levy renewal. WOW. When was the last year that Seattle didn’t have at least one levy renewal? He should have just run under the campaign slogan of “read my lips, no new taxes.”

    I suspect anti-transit crusader Licata is mostly just posturing to delay or kill the light rail measure.

  • misha

    Wow. Why the McGinn hate? I strongly approve of putting these measures on the ballot so we actually move forward – Seattle is not going to reject light rail and won’t reject the seawall unless the council sabotages the measure.

    I’ll add some Licata hate – here’s a man who has proven to be the most conservative member of the council for years and is not shy about it, yet the local media keeps giving him a free pass. He’s opposed to replacing the seawall because the levy would compete in a year with at least one levy renewal. WOW. When was the last year that Seattle didn’t have at least one levy renewal? He should have just run under the campaign slogan of “read my lips, no new taxes.”

    I suspect anti-transit crusader Licata is mostly just posturing to delay or kill the light rail measure.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    22 is correct, and he not only does not have the votes on anything that is in conflict with the council, but they have override votes.

    Now you know why he has one number fir the seawall replacement, and the AWV project has a different one (one he should have completely understood before this bullshit today).

    There is, afterall, a web page that has been there for a while.
    http://www.seattle.gov/transportation/seawall.htm

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    22 is correct, and he not only does not have the votes on anything that is in conflict with the council, but they have override votes.

    Now you know why he has one number fir the seawall replacement, and the AWV project has a different one (one he should have completely understood before this bullshit today).

    There is, afterall, a web page that has been there for a while.
    http://www.seattle.gov/transportation/seawall.htm

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Licata knows more about the city bond capacity then McGinn does. Forcing an early vote with a sniff of conflict is ripe for failrure. Once this forced vote fails it then will take picking through other ways to borrow and bond that compete with other things, possibly competing with bonding capacity.

    He is not leading, he is competing.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Licata knows more about the city bond capacity then McGinn does. Forcing an early vote with a sniff of conflict is ripe for failrure. Once this forced vote fails it then will take picking through other ways to borrow and bond that compete with other things, possibly competing with bonding capacity.

    He is not leading, he is competing.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Methodical consensus builder like Richard Conlin vs. smiling bomb thrower like McGinn.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Methodical consensus builder like Richard Conlin vs. smiling bomb thrower like McGinn.

  • Jane B

    The seawall definitely needs to be replaced – but I don’t understand McGinn’s emergency rush to suddenly place it on the ballot – especially since the City is trying to get federal stimulus dollars (of course the odds of the City getting federal $ are now slim to none since McGinn unveiled his levy proposal). I agree with @19 – either McGinn is using this to try and kill the tunnel or he didn’t really think through the implications (or perhaps some of both).

  • Jane B

    The seawall definitely needs to be replaced – but I don’t understand McGinn’s emergency rush to suddenly place it on the ballot – especially since the City is trying to get federal stimulus dollars (of course the odds of the City getting federal $ are now slim to none since McGinn unveiled his levy proposal). I agree with @19 – either McGinn is using this to try and kill the tunnel or he didn’t really think through the implications (or perhaps some of both).

  • Seamus O

    @26 Licata gave no pro or con, he simply stated there are several levies coming up. We have a new Mayor who (bless him!) is proposing levies at the rate of one per week. It’s responsible to ask about the big picture when considering multiple levies. A light rail ballot measure will get into at least a billion or so (who really knows how much?). City bonding capacity and taxing authority is limited, very limited compared to Sound Transit.

    The idea of light rail to Ballard and West Seattle is attractive, but I’m not even sure it’s feasible given current city bonding and taxing authority, without either changes in state law or big budget cuts elsewhere (for example: if you changed state law to allow light rail to be considered a utility for purposes of bonding, there’d be no problem to surmount other than a public vote).

    If asking about the big picture makes Licata conservative, I suspect there are 9 right-wing Councilmembers these days.

  • Seamus O

    @26 Licata gave no pro or con, he simply stated there are several levies coming up. We have a new Mayor who (bless him!) is proposing levies at the rate of one per week. It’s responsible to ask about the big picture when considering multiple levies. A light rail ballot measure will get into at least a billion or so (who really knows how much?). City bonding capacity and taxing authority is limited, very limited compared to Sound Transit.

    The idea of light rail to Ballard and West Seattle is attractive, but I’m not even sure it’s feasible given current city bonding and taxing authority, without either changes in state law or big budget cuts elsewhere (for example: if you changed state law to allow light rail to be considered a utility for purposes of bonding, there’d be no problem to surmount other than a public vote).

    If asking about the big picture makes Licata conservative, I suspect there are 9 right-wing Councilmembers these days.

  • misha

    Might as well skip the vote and go straight to waiting for bond capacity, am I right?

    Hint: This is the “transparency” the kids have been talking about. I can’t believe so many people here would rather have backroom deals and secret meetings about a proposal rather than being informed about it. If councilmembers are sad they didn’t get firstsies in hearing the latest gossip, that’s a sign of a petty and selfish person, not the fault of the mayor.

  • misha

    Might as well skip the vote and go straight to waiting for bond capacity, am I right?

    Hint: This is the “transparency” the kids have been talking about. I can’t believe so many people here would rather have backroom deals and secret meetings about a proposal rather than being informed about it. If councilmembers are sad they didn’t get firstsies in hearing the latest gossip, that’s a sign of a petty and selfish person, not the fault of the mayor.

  • Jane B

    And I just read Cary Moon’s comment of the day (you should re-post this). Cary’s right – we have one chance to get rebuilding the seawall done well – it would be really stupid to blow it by being in a huge rush to put it on a levy in a May vote. Also, won’t the city have to pay extra to hold a special election in May? Special elections don’t come cheap.

  • Jane B

    And I just read Cary Moon’s comment of the day (you should re-post this). Cary’s right – we have one chance to get rebuilding the seawall done well – it would be really stupid to blow it by being in a huge rush to put it on a levy in a May vote. Also, won’t the city have to pay extra to hold a special election in May? Special elections don’t come cheap.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    @32, this is not gossip, this is a policy requiring a quarter billion dollar vote, and legislative action by the council to get it there.
    Quite frankly, we did not need a press conference at all. There would, or would not be, a vote in May. We would be involved to act then. The council would have to act first. He should make an effort to communicate in the order that events take places.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    @32, this is not gossip, this is a policy requiring a quarter billion dollar vote, and legislative action by the council to get it there.
    Quite frankly, we did not need a press conference at all. There would, or would not be, a vote in May. We would be involved to act then. The council would have to act first. He should make an effort to communicate in the order that events take places.

  • Seamus O

    McGinn is brilliantly exploiting the key weakness of the case for the tunnel. Namely, that the alarmist rhetoric about the catastrophic public safety threat of a viaduct/seawall collapse always dictated immediate action rather than a long timeline. The Governor increased the cognitive dissonance by deciding to keep the Viaduct up until 2015.

    His case for immediate seawall replacement funding focuses on the imminent public safety threat. Can you think of another one?

    Next month WSDOT will release new cost estimates. Sky’s the limit! The state legislature will say Seattle has to pay the extra costs, and McGinn—being Seattle Mayor—can say no, loudly, provoking Seattle-hating legislators to defund the project. He can then loudly rail against the unacceptable threat to public safety of the Viaduct, paraphrasing Reagan: “Tear down this wall, Miss Gregoire!” Lacking funding, she’ll have no choice.

    De-facto surface option, delivered by mid-2010.

  • Seamus O

    McGinn is brilliantly exploiting the key weakness of the case for the tunnel. Namely, that the alarmist rhetoric about the catastrophic public safety threat of a viaduct/seawall collapse always dictated immediate action rather than a long timeline. The Governor increased the cognitive dissonance by deciding to keep the Viaduct up until 2015.

    His case for immediate seawall replacement funding focuses on the imminent public safety threat. Can you think of another one?

    Next month WSDOT will release new cost estimates. Sky’s the limit! The state legislature will say Seattle has to pay the extra costs, and McGinn—being Seattle Mayor—can say no, loudly, provoking Seattle-hating legislators to defund the project. He can then loudly rail against the unacceptable threat to public safety of the Viaduct, paraphrasing Reagan: “Tear down this wall, Miss Gregoire!” Lacking funding, she’ll have no choice.

    De-facto surface option, delivered by mid-2010.

  • hmmmmm

    @35: zzzzzz.

  • hmmmmm

    @35: zzzzzz.

  • Mr. Mike

    Word from downtownn is that it all seems to be going down like this. McGinn announces before speaking to anyone – often anyone who has already put months or years of research into an effort. He’s so gun ho to be a “maverick” that he’s running in blind and his administration wiull suffer for it.

    This is not a good sign and I’m not suprised. I think he’s a sham. He’s a one-term mayor and it’s going to be sloppy and waste a lot of time.

  • Mr. Mike

    Word from downtownn is that it all seems to be going down like this. McGinn announces before speaking to anyone – often anyone who has already put months or years of research into an effort. He’s so gun ho to be a “maverick” that he’s running in blind and his administration wiull suffer for it.

    This is not a good sign and I’m not suprised. I think he’s a sham. He’s a one-term mayor and it’s going to be sloppy and waste a lot of time.

  • Disgusted

    Amateur hour is right. From inside City Hall, I can tell you it’s been fire, aim, ready on all fronts from the get-go.

    First they let fly with three executive orders before they have the slightest idea of the actual personnel situation or the slightest notion of what they hope to accomplish with a personnel review. The target is set, then actual facts are compiled, and then finally rationales and methods are contrived to fit what they’ve publicly locked themselves into. Fire, aim, ready (maybe).

    Same with this waterfront proposal. Blindsided nearly everyone. Didn’t talk to Rasmussen ahead of time?!!? It’s legislation 101 that you don’t blindside your committee chair. If I were Council, I’d pronounce this DOA instantly just on style.

    For a guy who talks about process and collaboration and consultation all day long, he sure does seem to like these surprise, unilateral pronouncements. Does he not see the contradiction? I’m beginning to wonder if the man suffers from some kind of aphasia that prevents him from understanding others as peers and anticipating their reactions.

  • Disgusted

    Amateur hour is right. From inside City Hall, I can tell you it’s been fire, aim, ready on all fronts from the get-go.

    First they let fly with three executive orders before they have the slightest idea of the actual personnel situation or the slightest notion of what they hope to accomplish with a personnel review. The target is set, then actual facts are compiled, and then finally rationales and methods are contrived to fit what they’ve publicly locked themselves into. Fire, aim, ready (maybe).

    Same with this waterfront proposal. Blindsided nearly everyone. Didn’t talk to Rasmussen ahead of time?!!? It’s legislation 101 that you don’t blindside your committee chair. If I were Council, I’d pronounce this DOA instantly just on style.

    For a guy who talks about process and collaboration and consultation all day long, he sure does seem to like these surprise, unilateral pronouncements. Does he not see the contradiction? I’m beginning to wonder if the man suffers from some kind of aphasia that prevents him from understanding others as peers and anticipating their reactions.

  • FogOfWar

    The Machiavellian side of me says, “Brilliant maneuver!”
    The Seattle passive-aggressive side of me says,
    “Wtf? WTF!?!?” Of course, only in a blog.

    I think some folks need to this article from crosscut:
    “Memo to the Mayor McGinn’s Staff”

  • FogOfWar

    The Machiavellian side of me says, “Brilliant maneuver!”
    The Seattle passive-aggressive side of me says,
    “Wtf? WTF!?!?” Of course, only in a blog.

    I think some folks need to this article from crosscut:
    “Memo to the Mayor McGinn’s Staff”

  • FogOfWar

    @ 37. Mr. Mike
    @ 38. Disgusted

    It is a long way from being President of the Greenwood
    community council to Mayor of Seattle and +11 days in
    office. Everybody gets a couple passes…but not too
    many. I won’t judge too quickly…

  • FogOfWar

    @ 37. Mr. Mike
    @ 38. Disgusted

    It is a long way from being President of the Greenwood
    community council to Mayor of Seattle and +11 days in
    office. Everybody gets a couple passes…but not too
    many. I won’t judge too quickly…

  • aargh

    ohmygodhesaidhewantssomethingandhetoldthepublicwithouttellingtheinsidersfirst! ohmygodohmygohmygod!!!!!

    he needs to learn the etiquette. First, you have a backchannel communication to the insiders….I’m thinking about this or that….then you gauge their body language responses for six months…thenyou say hey folks i may actually take a position, just want to tell you I’m going to tell you about it later, I’m telling you I will tell you about it…oh thanks for telling us you will tell us about it…then a few months later, you tell them about it….and only THEN DO YOU TELL THE PUBLIC.

    damn mcginn, you’re acting like things will be different!

  • aargh

    ohmygodhesaidhewantssomethingandhetoldthepublicwithouttellingtheinsidersfirst! ohmygodohmygohmygod!!!!!

    he needs to learn the etiquette. First, you have a backchannel communication to the insiders….I’m thinking about this or that….then you gauge their body language responses for six months…thenyou say hey folks i may actually take a position, just want to tell you I’m going to tell you about it later, I’m telling you I will tell you about it…oh thanks for telling us you will tell us about it…then a few months later, you tell them about it….and only THEN DO YOU TELL THE PUBLIC.

    damn mcginn, you’re acting like things will be different!

  • tikka

    So, let me get this right:

    Christine, the state, and all those other SDOT folks believe that the seawall failing is catastrophic.

    McGinn agrees in the interest of public safety.

    The council moans because McGinn is taking action for the safety of lives….

    Um, and the haters think taking action on a problem that everyone agrees is a problem is a baaaaaaad thing…..exactly how?

  • tikka

    So, let me get this right:

    Christine, the state, and all those other SDOT folks believe that the seawall failing is catastrophic.

    McGinn agrees in the interest of public safety.

    The council moans because McGinn is taking action for the safety of lives….

    Um, and the haters think taking action on a problem that everyone agrees is a problem is a baaaaaaad thing…..exactly how?

  • The Riddler

    Taking bets for the office pool.

    How long do you think it will be before New York Born Mike McGinn from Long Island gets frustrated and starts cursing at everyone?

    Maybe around March?

  • The Riddler

    Taking bets for the office pool.

    How long do you think it will be before New York Born Mike McGinn from Long Island gets frustrated and starts cursing at everyone?

    Maybe around March?

  • http://www.dougunderground.com/ DOUG.

    Jean Godden looks lost in this photo, which is perfect.

  • http://www.dougunderground.com DOUG.

    Jean Godden looks lost in this photo, which is perfect.

  • Good Grief

    I think the delusion here on McGinn’s part is that he somehow won with more than 51.1% of the vote…

  • Good Grief

    I think the delusion here on McGinn’s part is that he somehow won with more than 51.1% of the vote…

  • Dick Burkhart

    Brilliant idea to separate the Seawall from the Viaduct, but yeh, it needs to happen along with the waterfront, and yeh, the council needs to be engaged in a discussion of options.

  • Dick Burkhart

    Brilliant idea to separate the Seawall from the Viaduct, but yeh, it needs to happen along with the waterfront, and yeh, the council needs to be engaged in a discussion of options.

  • Laury

    The mayor’s proposal isn’t completely out of the blue. Repairing the seawall is part of the viaduct replacement plan. According the Washington State DOT, it is city’s responsibility to replace the seawall: “The City would build a new roadway (funded by the State) and new public open space along the waterfront once the viaduct is removed, improve other city streets and replace the central waterfront seawall.” McGinn’s bond proposal is in keeping with the tunnel plan, and it is prudent, given the state’s financial difficulties.

    We’ve seen what has happened in Haiti. Our “big one” could happen any day. Check out this DOT simulation of what might happen to the seawall if a earthquake hit the waterfront: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hos_uIKwC-c&feature=player_embedded

  • Laury

    The mayor’s proposal isn’t completely out of the blue. Repairing the seawall is part of the viaduct replacement plan. According the Washington State DOT, it is city’s responsibility to replace the seawall: “The City would build a new roadway (funded by the State) and new public open space along the waterfront once the viaduct is removed, improve other city streets and replace the central waterfront seawall.” McGinn’s bond proposal is in keeping with the tunnel plan, and it is prudent, given the state’s financial difficulties.

    We’ve seen what has happened in Haiti. Our “big one” could happen any day. Check out this DOT simulation of what might happen to the seawall if a earthquake hit the waterfront: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hos_uIKwC-c&feature=player_embedded

  • eddiew

    ECB: “…a potential levy for light-rail expansion (undetermined, but the likeliest date appears to be November 2010)”; that seems two years early.

  • eddiew

    ECB: “…a potential levy for light-rail expansion (undetermined, but the likeliest date appears to be November 2010)”; that seems two years early.

  • http://www.joeszilagyi.com/ Joe Szilagyi

    32 says: “Hint: This is the “transparency” the kids have been talking about. I can’t believe so many people here would rather have backroom deals and secret meetings about a proposal rather than being informed about it. If councilmembers are sad they didn’t get firstsies in hearing the latest gossip, that’s a sign of a petty and selfish person, not the fault of the mayor.”

    WIN. Unless I’m mistaken the Council=Mayor/Mayor=Council for authority, right? Or am I wrong?

  • http://joeszilagyi.com Joe Szilagyi

    32 says: “Hint: This is the “transparency” the kids have been talking about. I can’t believe so many people here would rather have backroom deals and secret meetings about a proposal rather than being informed about it. If councilmembers are sad they didn’t get firstsies in hearing the latest gossip, that’s a sign of a petty and selfish person, not the fault of the mayor.”

    WIN. Unless I’m mistaken the Council=Mayor/Mayor=Council for authority, right? Or am I wrong?

  • Michael J. Maddux

    This was a major fail on behalf of the mayor, plain and simple.

    As has been repeated, bare minimum he should have spoken with Rasmussen. I don’t think it’s so much councilmembers being selfish as 32 says, rather setting them up for a deer in the headlights moment by the press is not the way to win their support.

    Like it or not, this has to be approved by the Council. As was also pointed out, McGinn won with just over 51% of the vote. Every other councilmember received a higher percentage, including those who are thinking about running for mayor in 3 years. Presenting a proposal via press conference to the public, and telling the Council what they have to do, especially when one or two want your job, is a sure fire way to start losing legislative battles early and often.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    This was a major fail on behalf of the mayor, plain and simple.

    As has been repeated, bare minimum he should have spoken with Rasmussen. I don’t think it’s so much councilmembers being selfish as 32 says, rather setting them up for a deer in the headlights moment by the press is not the way to win their support.

    Like it or not, this has to be approved by the Council. As was also pointed out, McGinn won with just over 51% of the vote. Every other councilmember received a higher percentage, including those who are thinking about running for mayor in 3 years. Presenting a proposal via press conference to the public, and telling the Council what they have to do, especially when one or two want your job, is a sure fire way to start losing legislative battles early and often.

  • morning fizzy

    Where does the $250MM number come from?

    From the Seattle Times in 2007 when the tunnel was going to use the seawall for one of its walls:

    The long-term fix is not as clear. Various proposals for replacing the viaduct call for a new seawall to be part of the project, but replacing the 8,000-foot seawall alone could cost more than $1 billion. And the gas-tax package the Legislature passed last weekend has just $177 million to replace the viaduct, leaving a big gap.

    What are we fixing for $250MM

  • morning fizzy

    Where does the $250MM number come from?

    From the Seattle Times in 2007 when the tunnel was going to use the seawall for one of its walls:

    The long-term fix is not as clear. Various proposals for replacing the viaduct call for a new seawall to be part of the project, but replacing the 8,000-foot seawall alone could cost more than $1 billion. And the gas-tax package the Legislature passed last weekend has just $177 million to replace the viaduct, leaving a big gap.

    What are we fixing for $250MM

  • Chris Stefan

    I don’t see any sort of underhanded attempt to kill the tunnel with McGinn’s Seawall proposal. I think he is honestly concerned about its condition and the public safety threat it poses. He may have seen the photos from Haiti and decided to act.

    Unfortunately this does point to a problem with Mayor McGinn, he’s known for his impulsiveness. While it is a refreshing change from debating everything until everyone is tired of talking about it or your hand is forced, it isn’t a great way to run a large city.

    At the very least the Mayor should have taken a bit of time to consult with city staff and the council first. A day or two delay in the announcement wouldn’t have really cost him anything.

    Also remember that the majority of people don’t know and don’t care about this insider baseball stuff. They see a mayor standing up and talking about a critical infrastructure need (illustrated by pictures of worm eaten timbers) of some urgency while the events in Haiti are fresh on everyone’s mind.

    The local media is talking about the need to replace the seawall and not the council getting snubbed so Mayor McGinn won the news cycle.

  • Chris Stefan

    I don’t see any sort of underhanded attempt to kill the tunnel with McGinn’s Seawall proposal. I think he is honestly concerned about its condition and the public safety threat it poses. He may have seen the photos from Haiti and decided to act.

    Unfortunately this does point to a problem with Mayor McGinn, he’s known for his impulsiveness. While it is a refreshing change from debating everything until everyone is tired of talking about it or your hand is forced, it isn’t a great way to run a large city.

    At the very least the Mayor should have taken a bit of time to consult with city staff and the council first. A day or two delay in the announcement wouldn’t have really cost him anything.

    Also remember that the majority of people don’t know and don’t care about this insider baseball stuff. They see a mayor standing up and talking about a critical infrastructure need (illustrated by pictures of worm eaten timbers) of some urgency while the events in Haiti are fresh on everyone’s mind.

    The local media is talking about the need to replace the seawall and not the council getting snubbed so Mayor McGinn won the news cycle.

  • 4chrissake

    Mike really cares about our city, much more than the rest of us. That must be it.

  • 4chrissake

    Mike really cares about our city, much more than the rest of us. That must be it.

  • oh and have a nice day!

    “How long do you think it will be before New York Born Mike McGinn from Long Island gets frustrated and starts cursing at everyone?”

    Oh, about as long as it will take yahoo native to passive aggressively play the ever-popular “transplant card.”

    At least, we hope he will start cursing that soon.

    It’d do Seattle politics a world of good to have some honest emotional communication, instead of uptight, repressed, behind the back, nonconfrontational, avoidant, faux-politesse bullshit.

    Don’t you agree?

  • oh and have a nice day!

    “How long do you think it will be before New York Born Mike McGinn from Long Island gets frustrated and starts cursing at everyone?”

    Oh, about as long as it will take yahoo native to passive aggressively play the ever-popular “transplant card.”

    At least, we hope he will start cursing that soon.

    It’d do Seattle politics a world of good to have some honest emotional communication, instead of uptight, repressed, behind the back, nonconfrontational, avoidant, faux-politesse bullshit.

    Don’t you agree?

  • ratcityreprobate

    Hmmmm. Anybody else notice that many of the same posters who were complaining two weeks ago about McGinn doing endless listening tours now are freaking about McGinn making a proposal to solve a known problem?

  • ratcityreprobate

    Hmmmm. Anybody else notice that many of the same posters who were complaining two weeks ago about McGinn doing endless listening tours now are freaking about McGinn making a proposal to solve a known problem?

  • Progressive.

    The council consulted no-one when they get to-gether and approved Memoridum of the Alaska Way Viaduct behind the closed doors despite of the popular opposition from the Seattle taxe payers. Are the council listening to the people of Seattle, the answers is No.

  • Progressive.

    The council consulted no-one when they get to-gether and approved Memoridum of the Alaska Way Viaduct behind the closed doors despite of the popular opposition from the Seattle taxe payers. Are the council listening to the people of Seattle, the answers is No.

  • Disgusted

    I think people are forgetting that Council already doesn’t trust the Mayor on this topic. They went to the step of hiring their own lobbyist in Olympia to make sure the Mayor didn’t take control of the City’s position here.

    So, if we take the Mayor at his word that he’s worried about safety, that the Seawall and Viaduct projects really are fully separable from an engineering perspective, and that he wants to accelerate the timeframe for safety reasons, it would behoove him to reach out collaboratively with Council to convince them of these points, and then announce the plan with Richard Conlin and Tom Rasmussen (and any others he could get) standing smiling next to him to show that the proposal is serious and has legs.

    Nothing required him to dangle that safety baby out the window precisely yesterday at 9:30 a.m. while Council was away and without adequate background preparation. The safety problem has been staring us in the face for years. Yesterday was pure choice and terrible political management.

  • Disgusted

    I think people are forgetting that Council already doesn’t trust the Mayor on this topic. They went to the step of hiring their own lobbyist in Olympia to make sure the Mayor didn’t take control of the City’s position here.

    So, if we take the Mayor at his word that he’s worried about safety, that the Seawall and Viaduct projects really are fully separable from an engineering perspective, and that he wants to accelerate the timeframe for safety reasons, it would behoove him to reach out collaboratively with Council to convince them of these points, and then announce the plan with Richard Conlin and Tom Rasmussen (and any others he could get) standing smiling next to him to show that the proposal is serious and has legs.

    Nothing required him to dangle that safety baby out the window precisely yesterday at 9:30 a.m. while Council was away and without adequate background preparation. The safety problem has been staring us in the face for years. Yesterday was pure choice and terrible political management.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @52 -

    You do have a point. Only the truly-without-a-life folks (myself included) would care about the council snub. However, what I’m looking at is his ability to get things done in the future (including this) that require the Council to be on board. Realistically, I don’t see this issue staying in the news long enough for him to really pressure the Council to do what he wants, and they may very well just say “hey, we’re doing that as part of the tunnel rebuild, keep your pants on,” or something to that effect.

    While most Seattleites may not care about him snubbing the Council, they are the ones in a position to exert some real control over the agenda, and there are at least two, if not three, that will probably be looking to really stand up to McGinn so they can run in 2013.

    In the end, I only express concern because I don’t want to see the city shut down for three and a half years. I didn’t vote for McGinn, but for the sake of Seattle, I would like him to at least have some semblance of governance while he is in office. And part of that is maintaining a positive relationship with the City Council.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @52 -

    You do have a point. Only the truly-without-a-life folks (myself included) would care about the council snub. However, what I’m looking at is his ability to get things done in the future (including this) that require the Council to be on board. Realistically, I don’t see this issue staying in the news long enough for him to really pressure the Council to do what he wants, and they may very well just say “hey, we’re doing that as part of the tunnel rebuild, keep your pants on,” or something to that effect.

    While most Seattleites may not care about him snubbing the Council, they are the ones in a position to exert some real control over the agenda, and there are at least two, if not three, that will probably be looking to really stand up to McGinn so they can run in 2013.

    In the end, I only express concern because I don’t want to see the city shut down for three and a half years. I didn’t vote for McGinn, but for the sake of Seattle, I would like him to at least have some semblance of governance while he is in office. And part of that is maintaining a positive relationship with the City Council.

  • rtm

    I think the folks who think McGinn is “impulsive” and the job is too big for him forget the campaign. McGinn entered a long time ago, was outspent every step of the way. He won by making smart strategic choices and sticking with them. His smarts only become apparent when the votes are finally counted. Remember how he had no shot in the primary? Remember Mallahan’s poll lead?

    People who doubt McGinn lose. A lot. Not saying this was handled perfectly, but give the guy a little credit for being smart and patient.

  • rtm

    I think the folks who think McGinn is “impulsive” and the job is too big for him forget the campaign. McGinn entered a long time ago, was outspent every step of the way. He won by making smart strategic choices and sticking with them. His smarts only become apparent when the votes are finally counted. Remember how he had no shot in the primary? Remember Mallahan’s poll lead?

    People who doubt McGinn lose. A lot. Not saying this was handled perfectly, but give the guy a little credit for being smart and patient.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @59 -

    Being patient would have been talking with Rasmussen and Conlin before making some big announcement, not after. He was being anything but patient with this decision.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @59 -

    Being patient would have been talking with Rasmussen and Conlin before making some big announcement, not after. He was being anything but patient with this decision.

  • hoary

    He’s mayor. His job is to make big city decisions. For this decision, he’s asking voters if they want to pay for a major infra-structural improvement.

    WTF is everyone whining about? If you disagree, vote/campaign against the measure. We voted the last guy out for doing nothing…

  • hoary

    He’s mayor. His job is to make big city decisions. For this decision, he’s asking voters if they want to pay for a major infra-structural improvement.

    WTF is everyone whining about? If you disagree, vote/campaign against the measure. We voted the last guy out for doing nothing…

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @61 -

    Perhaps you’re not paying attention – it can’t just be put on the ballot. And his job is to govern after the Council passes laws that include policy. He’s telling the City Council to pass legislation and put it to the voters, not asking them. If you know anything about politics, an executive telling a legislative branch to do something without talking with them never ends well.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    @61 -

    Perhaps you’re not paying attention – it can’t just be put on the ballot. And his job is to govern after the Council passes laws that include policy. He’s telling the City Council to pass legislation and put it to the voters, not asking them. If you know anything about politics, an executive telling a legislative branch to do something without talking with them never ends well.

  • Random Seattlite

    Hey hey hey, this is Gov. 2.0, 2.1 due any day now.

  • Random Seattlite

    Hey hey hey, this is Gov. 2.0, 2.1 due any day now.

  • wtf?

    that’s right.

    conlin, rasmussen, gooden — they’d all support hemcginn sewall proposal except for one thing….he didn’t give them a preview!

    for that, they will change their mind and oppose it.

    wow, that’s really adult. “Gotcha, you didn’t follow etiquette, so I will not support your proposal!”

    What is this the 17th century royal court in France?

    Get a grip people. if it’s a good idea the council will support it, if not not, whether or not mcginn had 3 premeetings is not at all important.

    unless you think the councilmembers are children incapable of focuing on the public good….

    this is soooo seattle, debating whether someone was impolite by not giving a preview to someone, instead of debating the actual proposal itself!

    totally dysfunctional.

  • wtf?

    that’s right.

    conlin, rasmussen, gooden — they’d all support hemcginn sewall proposal except for one thing….he didn’t give them a preview!

    for that, they will change their mind and oppose it.

    wow, that’s really adult. “Gotcha, you didn’t follow etiquette, so I will not support your proposal!”

    What is this the 17th century royal court in France?

    Get a grip people. if it’s a good idea the council will support it, if not not, whether or not mcginn had 3 premeetings is not at all important.

    unless you think the councilmembers are children incapable of focuing on the public good….

    this is soooo seattle, debating whether someone was impolite by not giving a preview to someone, instead of debating the actual proposal itself!

    totally dysfunctional.

  • Soapboxin’

    While this debate is fascinating (how many times have I hit “Refresh?”), most of the Times comments do fall into 1 of 2 categories:

    1. No taxes
    2. Safe seawall = good

    Having absorbed all of this discussion, I go back to the promise of transparency. If McGinn is really pursuing some back-room strategy that he and his mindtrust have cooked up, how transparent is that?

    This is a well-educated city w/many finely-tuned Bullshit Detectors. We are extremely well aware of how difficult, complex, and important these decisions are.

    Just level with us.

  • Soapboxin’

    While this debate is fascinating (how many times have I hit “Refresh?”), most of the Times comments do fall into 1 of 2 categories:

    1. No taxes
    2. Safe seawall = good

    Having absorbed all of this discussion, I go back to the promise of transparency. If McGinn is really pursuing some back-room strategy that he and his mindtrust have cooked up, how transparent is that?

    This is a well-educated city w/many finely-tuned Bullshit Detectors. We are extremely well aware of how difficult, complex, and important these decisions are.

    Just level with us.

  • twocents

    What a friggin idiot. Separating the seawall from the rest of the project to fail the tunnel; going back on his promise, a decision he announced just to get him get elected. Typical lying scumbag. He has ten minutes left.

  • twocents

    What a friggin idiot. Separating the seawall from the rest of the project to fail the tunnel; going back on his promise, a decision he announced just to get him get elected. Typical lying scumbag. He has ten minutes left.

  • Last Word

    Can I have the last word?

  • Last Word

    Can I have the last word?

  • Michael J. Maddux

    Nope.

  • Michael J. Maddux

    Nope.

  • AJ

    So, we’re good?

    All this panic about building NOWNOWNOW — McGinn wants to do that, so we’re good, right?

    McGinn is playing you all for fools, and it’s delightful. Every second person in this city (plus a handful more) will laugh when everyone realizes McGinn called your bluff. You said he’s an obstructionist, but now who’s the obstructionist? You said he wants to do the “seattle method” and study things to death, but who’s saying we need to study the seawall to death?

    I need to go pop some popcorn.

  • AJ

    So, we’re good?

    All this panic about building NOWNOWNOW — McGinn wants to do that, so we’re good, right?

    McGinn is playing you all for fools, and it’s delightful. Every second person in this city (plus a handful more) will laugh when everyone realizes McGinn called your bluff. You said he’s an obstructionist, but now who’s the obstructionist? You said he wants to do the “seattle method” and study things to death, but who’s saying we need to study the seawall to death?

    I need to go pop some popcorn.

  • Mikos

    McGinn is simply trying to isolate the viaduct replacement from the the other parts of this generalized project. When the seawall has been fixed, the utilities moved and the surrounding streets upgraded, then we can all consider the pros and cons of the tunnel on their own merits. I suspect McGinn believes that’s his best chance to kill the tunnel.

  • Mikos

    McGinn is simply trying to isolate the viaduct replacement from the the other parts of this generalized project. When the seawall has been fixed, the utilities moved and the surrounding streets upgraded, then we can all consider the pros and cons of the tunnel on their own merits. I suspect McGinn believes that’s his best chance to kill the tunnel.

  • 4chrissake

    “When the seawall has been fixed, the utilities moved and the surrounding streets upgraded, then we can all consider the pros and cons of the tunnel”

    The seawall replacement will take years, Mikos. The tunnel should be mostly in place by that time, insha-Allah.

  • 4chrissake

    “When the seawall has been fixed, the utilities moved and the surrounding streets upgraded, then we can all consider the pros and cons of the tunnel”

    The seawall replacement will take years, Mikos. The tunnel should be mostly in place by that time, insha-Allah.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Maybe he thinks that he is separating the seawall from the viaduct, just as likely he is separating a levy vote on the seawall from a levy vote on west side light rail.
    He may be sandbagging his own rail vote by forcing a loser levy vote early.
    As it is, rapid ride bus service has already been approved and deployed before dualrail has its first budget failure.
    The seawall planning and proposals have been in motion for a while. He stepped in a choppaduct the current activity.

  • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mr-Baker/150568099583 Mr.Baker

    Maybe he thinks that he is separating the seawall from the viaduct, just as likely he is separating a levy vote on the seawall from a levy vote on west side light rail.
    He may be sandbagging his own rail vote by forcing a loser levy vote early.
    As it is, rapid ride bus service has already been approved and deployed before dualrail has its first budget failure.
    The seawall planning and proposals have been in motion for a while. He stepped in a choppaduct the current activity.

  • chicagoexpat

    those of us who pointed out that McGinn’s inability to work & play well with others — including his own staff, whom he treats like crap — would be a hallmark of his part-time mayor job.

    He already has all the solutions, he doesn’t need to even talk to city council. They can deal with it, he figgers, as he merrily bikes around the city on the public dime.

  • chicagoexpat

    those of us who pointed out that McGinn’s inability to work & play well with others — including his own staff, whom he treats like crap — would be a hallmark of his part-time mayor job.

    He already has all the solutions, he doesn’t need to even talk to city council. They can deal with it, he figgers, as he merrily bikes around the city on the public dime.

  • chicagoexpat

    again, this part-time mayor/full-time cyclists also takes a 6 figure income while trying to get rid of that belly

    hope ur happy

  • chicagoexpat

    again, this part-time mayor/full-time cyclists also takes a 6 figure income while trying to get rid of that belly

    hope ur happy

  • ndplume

    Yeah, I have a problem with the insistence on biking. Sure, set an example for reducing dependence on your car, but it can take a lot longer to get to official functions via bicycle (as you suggest @73, time we are paying for) and his showing up at events late and rumpled does not give us confidence in his judgement and it disses those waiting for him.

  • ndplume

    Yeah, I have a problem with the insistence on biking. Sure, set an example for reducing dependence on your car, but it can take a lot longer to get to official functions via bicycle (as you suggest @73, time we are paying for) and his showing up at events late and rumpled does not give us confidence in his judgement and it disses those waiting for him.

  • fatty

    Think about this carefully….

    1. How many people do you know ride a bicycle as much as our slim new mayor claims to ride?

    2. How many of #1 share a waist-band size with Jaba-The-Hut?

    McGinn is full of shit.

  • fatty

    Think about this carefully….

    1. How many people do you know ride a bicycle as much as our slim new mayor claims to ride?

    2. How many of #1 share a waist-band size with Jaba-The-Hut?

    McGinn is full of shit.

  • 1 in ten chance

    1 in ten chance.

    1 in ten chance.

    tell us the truth, is there a 1 in ten chance the seawall will fail in the next ten years? If so waiting is stupid. If not, McGinn is stupid.

    He said a 1 in ten chance in his little op ed today.

    REAL reporting wouldn’t focus on how Cary Moon “feels” or whether or not Rasmussen was told 12 hours earlier or not or whether he feels “slighted” or blindsided” and wouldn’t focus on this as a drama queen issue smack down between the council and the mayor.

    REAL reporting would inform us: is there a 1 in ten chance it will fail?

    OR NOT????????

    Because we’re just citizens sitting here reading your posts about the drama queen aspects and the made up controversy aspects and so and so’s feeling blindsided and all that crap.

    But really, FIRST we need to know FACTS,

    if you care to bother reporting them.

  • 1 in ten chance

    1 in ten chance.

    1 in ten chance.

    tell us the truth, is there a 1 in ten chance the seawall will fail in the next ten years? If so waiting is stupid. If not, McGinn is stupid.

    He said a 1 in ten chance in his little op ed today.

    REAL reporting wouldn’t focus on how Cary Moon “feels” or whether or not Rasmussen was told 12 hours earlier or not or whether he feels “slighted” or blindsided” and wouldn’t focus on this as a drama queen issue smack down between the council and the mayor.

    REAL reporting would inform us: is there a 1 in ten chance it will fail?

    OR NOT????????

    Because we’re just citizens sitting here reading your posts about the drama queen aspects and the made up controversy aspects and so and so’s feeling blindsided and all that crap.

    But really, FIRST we need to know FACTS,

    if you care to bother reporting them.